Open Forum

Hello all,

Do you have experience using virtual reality or augmented reality with young children (ages 0-7)? I'd love to hear about it! What works and what doesn't work? What concerns you? What excites you? What are best practices? I am also looking for any publication/resources relating to this topic.

Thank you!!

___________
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston, MA

------------------------------
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston MA
------------------------------

I would be concerned about aiming any kind of digital media programming, including virtual reality, at kids under age 2. The little ones learn best by interacting with the real world, not a virtual or augmented world. The current AAP recommendations state "Avoid digital media for toddlers younger than 18 to 24 months other than video chatting." (Children and Media Tips from the American Academy of Pediatrics)

------------------------------
Emily Robinson
Collections Manager
Birthplace of Country Music Museum
Bristol, TN/VA
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-18-2018 10:34 AM
From: Ivy Bardaglio
Subject: virtual reality + early learners

Hello all,

Do you have experience using virtual reality or augmented reality with young children (ages 0-7)? I'd love to hear about it! What works and what doesn't work? What concerns you? What excites you? What are best practices? I am also looking for any publication/resources relating to this topic.

Thank you!!

___________
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston, MA

------------------------------
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston MA
------------------------------

Original Message------

I would be concerned about aiming any kind of digital media programming, including virtual reality, at kids under age 2. The little ones learn best by interacting with the real world, not a virtual or augmented world. The current AAP recommendations state "Avoid digital media for toddlers younger than 18 to 24 months other than video chatting." (Children and Media Tips from the American Academy of Pediatrics)

------------------------------
Emily Robinson
Collections Manager
Birthplace of Country Music Museum
Bristol, TN/VA
------------------------------

These guidelines were extremely helpful, thank you!

------------------------------
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston MA
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-19-2018 09:26 AM
From: Emily Robinson
Subject: virtual reality + early learners

I would be concerned about aiming any kind of digital media programming, including virtual reality, at kids under age 2. The little ones learn best by interacting with the real world, not a virtual or augmented world. The current AAP recommendations state "Avoid digital media for toddlers younger than 18 to 24 months other than video chatting." (Children and Media Tips from the American Academy of Pediatrics)

------------------------------
Emily Robinson
Collections Manager
Birthplace of Country Music Museum
Bristol, TN/VA

Original Message:
Sent: 12-18-2018 10:34 AM
From: Ivy Bardaglio
Subject: virtual reality + early learners

Hello all,

Do you have experience using virtual reality or augmented reality with young children (ages 0-7)? I'd love to hear about it! What works and what doesn't work? What concerns you? What excites you? What are best practices? I am also looking for any publication/resources relating to this topic.

Thank you!!

___________
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston, MA

------------------------------
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston MA
------------------------------

Hello Ivy,

The main concern I've heard is around their neck muscles not being strong enough to support the VR headsets on their face.  I can imagine that viewing the VR or AR on a phone/tablet instead of in a headset would be a way around that.

I can suggest following #MuseumVR on Twitter for the latest updates on museums and VR.  

Another hashtag is #ARVRinEDU which is used in the formal education world for what classrooms are doing with AR and VR, which may go as young as 5-7 yrs.  I listed to a webinar from Jaime Donally and she regularly shares resources on her website:
https://www.arvrinedu.com/

I think we'll start to see more of kids creating their own VR/AR using programs like CoSpaces and Merge Cube.
https://cospaces.io/edu/
https://mergevr.com/cube 

Those are some of my thoughts.  Happy to connect more!  Most of what I've done so far has been using 360 video in VR headsets.  I wrote on that here: https://www.sheddaquarium.org/blog/2017/april/virtual-reality-bringing-shedd-aquarium-to-learners-in-360/
Since that write up, we've created underwater 360 videos, for even more immersive experiences, kind of feeds like the viewer is snorkeling.

Miranda


------------------------------
Miranda Kerr
Manager of Digital Learning
John G. Shedd Aquarium
Chicago IL
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-18-2018 10:34 AM
From: Ivy Bardaglio
Subject: virtual reality + early learners

Hello all,

Do you have experience using virtual reality or augmented reality with young children (ages 0-7)? I'd love to hear about it! What works and what doesn't work? What concerns you? What excites you? What are best practices? I am also looking for any publication/resources relating to this topic.

Thank you!!

___________
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston, MA

------------------------------
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston MA
------------------------------

There are a lot of issues to think of including the ones that are talked about but from the tech side of things here is what concerns me.  First is the quality of Virtual Reality.  Children even at the age of 5 are exposed to 4k quality video games that are developed by 50 to 100 designers and programmers and spend a year or two to get these results and at the cost of millions of dollars. I don't see how a museum can come close to that level of tech.  I would rather see the money go towards real-world interactives maybe an audio tour or a creative tablet interactive. I know there are people that will say I am wrong but to do tech for the sake of having the tech is not a reason to do it.  

The Tech
As for the hardware it is very expensive (I am not just talking about the goggles you need a powerful computer to run the goggles) and if you plan for more then one person (child) to use it at a time <g class="gr_ gr_1659 gr-alert gr_spell gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim ContextualSpelling ins-del" id="1659" data-gr-id="1659">then</g> it is really expensive.  Also as exciting as this technology is it's still in its infancy, you can look at Google and there are questions about if VR is dead, think of it this way do you own a 3D TV?  That was the hot thing 6 - 8 years ago and they talked about how all the movies were going to be in 3D. 

What are the major stumbling blocks,  you will find that it's the computer, the headset and getting it set up correctly on someone's head making sure that everything is in focus?  Then you have a problem with people with glasses, I wear glasses and most VR headsets don't fit over my glasses. Next, you need to create an <g class="gr_ gr_3545 gr-alert gr_spell gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim ContextualSpelling" id="3545" data-gr-id="3545">interactive</g> that is engaging and easy for a 5-7-year-olds to navigate.

In the Museum
Now let's say you have funding for the hardware and software development now you need staff to assist with putting the headset on the child and maintaining and cleaning the headsets after each child has used it.  If you have maybe 5 headsets and a class of 20 children your VR can't be more then 3 minutes because it will take about a 2 to 3 minutes to clean and set up each child which means you might have children waiting 20 minutes to use it for 3 minutes.

The Future

Let's look a year or two down the road, All of this money you dumped into this technology is now old... Yes, old your cool VR that you spent a ton of money in developing looks like an Atari from the 80 compared to what has changed over the past two years. And now most have seen the interactive and usage drops off because its a one hit wonder. You will have to make sure you fund this every year for maintenance and software development also how long will it be before the headsets break or something happens that this tech is pulled and collects dust on a shelf.

Please don't get me wrong I am a tech-junkie and I build interactives for my museum and right now I don't see this tech as something that we should invest in right now.  Maybe augmented reality that uses the person's phone but this too has a high development cost and will need to be maintained and updated as the technology changes. 

Look at Google and do some research and you will see even die-hard users have issues with the setup of the googles and they all talk about how a lot of this is marketing hype and the technology is progressing slowly.  To be honest I think outside of a novelty most people don't want to wear stuff on their head/face to play games or watch TV which is why 3D Tv's failed just think if you had to have 3D glasses in order to watch a movie at home.

<g class="gr_ gr_8221 gr-alert gr_gramm gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim Punctuation only-ins replaceWithoutSep" id="8221" data-gr-id="8221">OK</g> I am ready for the negative comments...

------------------------------
Raymond Stivala
Manager of Web/Multimedia Development
The Newark Museum
Newark NJ
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-18-2018 10:34 AM
From: Ivy Bardaglio
Subject: virtual reality + early learners

Hello all,

Do you have experience using virtual reality or augmented reality with young children (ages 0-7)? I'd love to hear about it! What works and what doesn't work? What concerns you? What excites you? What are best practices? I am also looking for any publication/resources relating to this topic.

Thank you!!

___________
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston, MA

------------------------------
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston MA
------------------------------

You make a lot of good points!  But  museums can be dipping our toes into the technology with much less budget than you describe.  This is a different level than something like an Oculus set-up like you mention.  We are using $20 headsets and Samsung phones.  We have some wipes to wipe down the headsets in between, but that's simple.  The 360 camera I mention was $500 and has allowed us to "bring the aquarium" out to kids.  We are also able to give the camera to teens, let them create the 360 videos themselves.  Here's a few photos of it in action:
https://twitter.com/SheddLearning/status/1050885820381614080
https://twitter.com/SheddLearning/status/990307399318884352
https://twitter.com/SheddLearning/status/895811654012870656 
https://twitter.com/SheddLearning/status/880479444514766848 
https://twitter.com/SheddLearning/status/858366540260966400

------------------------------
Miranda Kerr
Coordinator of Digital Learning
John G. Shedd Aquarium
Chicago IL
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-19-2018 11:22 AM
From: Raymond Stivala
Subject: virtual reality + early learners

There are a lot of issues to think of including the ones that are talked about but from the tech side of things here is what concerns me.  First is the quality of Virtual Reality.  Children even at the age of 5 are exposed to 4k quality video games that are developed by 50 to 100 designers and programmers and spend a year or two to get these results and at the cost of millions of dollars. I don't see how a museum can come close to that level of tech.  I would rather see the money go towards real-world interactives maybe an audio tour or a creative tablet interactive. I know there are people that will say I am wrong but to do tech for the sake of having the tech is not a reason to do it.

The Tech
As for the hardware it is very expensive (I am not just talking about the goggles you need a powerful computer to run the goggles) and if you plan for more then one person (child) to use it at a time <g class="gr_ gr_1659 gr-alert gr_spell gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim ContextualSpelling ins-del" id="1659" data-gr-id="1659">then</g> it is really expensive.  Also as exciting as this technology is it's still in its infancy, you can look at Google and there are questions about if VR is dead, think of it this way do you own a 3D TV?  That was the hot thing 6 - 8 years ago and they talked about how all the movies were going to be in 3D.

What are the major stumbling blocks,  you will find that it's the computer, the headset and getting it set up correctly on someone's head making sure that everything is in focus?  Then you have a problem with people with glasses, I wear glasses and most VR headsets don't fit over my glasses. Next, you need to create an <g class="gr_ gr_3545 gr-alert gr_spell gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim ContextualSpelling" id="3545" data-gr-id="3545">interactive</g> that is engaging and easy for a 5-7-year-olds to navigate.

In the Museum
Now let's say you have funding for the hardware and software development now you need staff to assist with putting the headset on the child and maintaining and cleaning the headsets after each child has used it.  If you have maybe 5 headsets and a class of 20 children your VR can't be more then 3 minutes because it will take about a 2 to 3 minutes to clean and set up each child which means you might have children waiting 20 minutes to use it for 3 minutes.

The Future

Let's look a year or two down the road, All of this money you dumped into this technology is now old... Yes, old your cool VR that you spent a ton of money in developing looks like an Atari from the 80 compared to what has changed over the past two years. And now most have seen the interactive and usage drops off because its a one hit wonder. You will have to make sure you fund this every year for maintenance and software development also how long will it be before the headsets break or something happens that this tech is pulled and collects dust on a shelf.

Please don't get me wrong I am a tech-junkie and I build interactives for my museum and right now I don't see this tech as something that we should invest in right now.  Maybe augmented reality that uses the person's phone but this too has a high development cost and will need to be maintained and updated as the technology changes.

Look at Google and do some research and you will see even die-hard users have issues with the setup of the googles and they all talk about how a lot of this is marketing hype and the technology is progressing slowly.  To be honest I think outside of a novelty most people don't want to wear stuff on their head/face to play games or watch TV which is why 3D Tv's failed just think if you had to have 3D glasses in order to watch a movie at home.

<g class="gr_ gr_8221 gr-alert gr_gramm gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim Punctuation only-ins replaceWithoutSep" id="8221" data-gr-id="8221">OK</g> I am ready for the negative comments...

------------------------------
Raymond Stivala
Manager of Web/Multimedia Development
The Newark Museum
Newark NJ

Original Message:
Sent: 12-18-2018 10:34 AM
From: Ivy Bardaglio
Subject: virtual reality + early learners

Hello all,

Do you have experience using virtual reality or augmented reality with young children (ages 0-7)? I'd love to hear about it! What works and what doesn't work? What concerns you? What excites you? What are best practices? I am also looking for any publication/resources relating to this topic.

Thank you!!

___________
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston, MA

------------------------------
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston MA
------------------------------

Original Message------

You make a lot of good points!  But  museums can be dipping our toes into the technology with much less budget than you describe.  This is a different level than something like an Oculus set-up like you mention.  We are using $20 headsets and Samsung phones.  We have some wipes to wipe down the headsets in between, but that's simple.  The 360 camera I mention was $500 and has allowed us to "bring the aquarium" out to kids.  We are also able to give the camera to teens, let them create the 360 videos themselves.  Here's a few photos of it in action:
https://twitter.com/SheddLearning/status/1050885820381614080
https://twitter.com/SheddLearning/status/990307399318884352
https://twitter.com/SheddLearning/status/895811654012870656 
https://twitter.com/SheddLearning/status/880479444514766848 
https://twitter.com/SheddLearning/status/858366540260966400

------------------------------
Miranda Kerr
Coordinator of Digital Learning
John G. Shedd Aquarium
Chicago IL
------------------------------

Hello:
At the Queens Museum in Flushing Meadows Corona Park, New York, we had an exhibit called "Never Built New York". It had a virtual reality piece built to work within the Panorama, our scale model of New York City. 

The visitor, of any age, could put on a headset and look at any of the white, ghostly mock-ups of the models of buildings designed but never realized, and  see it morph into what it might have looked like if it had. As one watched, a narration would tell the background of the designers, the building, and what happened. Though not confined to the young, they flocked to it, and their enthusiasm of an already beloved model was intensified. They had many ideas of how they would add to it. This was the same effect on adults, who offered many additional ideas which were really wonderful for us, as we were in the midst of gathering customer experience information about the direction to go in with the Panorama and how we use it in the museum's Education efforts.

I think any technology has to be incorporated meaningfully if any user, young or old is to benefit. This means a solid understanding of what sort of story you want to tell -- in NBNY's case it was the story of the buildings never realized and how the drama behind them: political, pure favoritism, location, how it would have changed the city -- were revealed visually, thus bringing what might have been a rote telling of a story more to life. We had the benefit of the magical Panorama to build upon for the overall effect.

The VR was so much better than just watching a video or slides. There was something so neat about looking over the model, focusing on a replica and then having it begin its story, pulling you in. The "gimmicky" gaming quality worked perfectly within the overall exhibition. Check out some information about the exhibition: https://queensmuseum.org/2016/10/never-built-new-york; https://christianwassmann.com/never-built-new-york.

------------------------------
Jennifer Vignone
Artist
Visitor Experience Associate, Queens Museum
Queens, New York
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-18-2018 10:34 AM
From: Ivy Bardaglio
Subject: virtual reality + early learners

Hello all,

Do you have experience using virtual reality or augmented reality with young children (ages 0-7)? I'd love to hear about it! What works and what doesn't work? What concerns you? What excites you? What are best practices? I am also looking for any publication/resources relating to this topic.

Thank you!!

___________
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston, MA

------------------------------
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston MA
------------------------------

Hello Ivy, There's an article in the most recent issue of Exhibition titled "Digital Interactive Experiences in a Children's Museum", by Katie Chandler from RK&A and Jennifer Kalter, formerly at Please Touch Museum, now at the New York Transit Museum. Their findings, while not specifically focused on VR or AR, cover both characteristics of successful digital interactives for children and Adult visitor perceptions of digital experiences in Children's Museums. You might reach out to them to see if they had any findings specific to VR or AR.

Penny

------------------------------
Penny Jennings
Associate Director for Experience Development
Oakland Museum of California
Oakland CA
pjennings@museumca.org
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-18-2018 10:34 AM
From: Ivy Bardaglio
Subject: virtual reality + early learners

Hello all,

Do you have experience using virtual reality or augmented reality with young children (ages 0-7)? I'd love to hear about it! What works and what doesn't work? What concerns you? What excites you? What are best practices? I am also looking for any publication/resources relating to this topic.

Thank you!!

___________
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston, MA

------------------------------
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston MA
------------------------------

Hi everyone, 

My name is Kai and I have a virtual reality company that specifically films VR experiences at museums and then brings them back to schools.


Although I usually try to only do VR with students age 10 and up-- I have lots of kids age 3-7 that are extremely interested.
For those children, I use a cardboard VR headset as it's much lighter and normally isn't strapped to their heads. 

As a former teacher, what excites me post is giving students access to a world they've been typically denied due to socioeconomic factors. 

I could talk about this topic for days and am happy to help if anyone has questions. My CTO and I both came from the US Holocaust Memorial Museum and are well versed with museums. I've served on AAM's Media & Tech Committee and now sit on the Board of Directors for the Museum Computer Network.

Happy New Year! 


------------------------------
-Kai
Founder & CEO, Curated x Kai
Board of Directors, Museum Computer Network
e: Kai@CuratedxKai
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-18-2018 10:34 AM
From: Ivy Bardaglio
Subject: virtual reality + early learners

Hello all,

Do you have experience using virtual reality or augmented reality with young children (ages 0-7)? I'd love to hear about it! What works and what doesn't work? What concerns you? What excites you? What are best practices? I am also looking for any publication/resources relating to this topic.

Thank you!!

___________
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston, MA

------------------------------
Ivy Bardaglio
STEAM & Maker Coordinator
Boston Children's Museum
Boston MA
------------------------------